Episode 19 - Professional Adaptability

Professional Adaptability Skills in the Workplace

Episode 19 – JuvoHub Podcast

What is professional adaptability in the workplace? 2020 taught us many things, especially about change and how we choose to manage it. Join us as we discuss the necessary skill of professional adaptability.

Host(s): Jonathan Saar from Market Me Social and Mark Howell from Howl Creative Concepts

Our special guest(s): Pauline Houchins, Executive Vice President of First Communities

Pauline Houchins joined First Communities in 2012 with over 23 years of multifamily experience. She has served leadership roles in several areas of our industry, including management, marketing, and training. Pauline also brings extensive vendor partnership experience and continues to be an active member of the Atlanta Apartment Association.

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Show highlights 

The housing community faced many challenges in 2020. We are so happy to have Pauline join us to share her thoughts on versatility and how it helped her overcome the many obstacles that both she and her staff faced.  

We talk about overcoming hurdles like new technology, rapidly changing policies and procedures, and home-based work. Perhaps most importantly, we also discuss the impact on everyone’s mental health and how we can better support each other.

So please listen in as we discuss professional adaptability and how to master new ways of doing business.

Some questions we consider:

  • How did we engage with our employees in 2020 during the pandemic? What were some of the biggest obstacles?
  • What did we learn about the different generations we have as employees in regards to engagement?
  • Were the worries different? And how?
  • Tell me how your teams learned technology and stayed adaptable during 2020.
  • What changed YOU in 2020?

What one actionable tips could you share that has served you well as an educator?

People will adapt if that is the only option that is available.

Pauline Houchins

Be mindful of your business.

Pauline Houchins

If you enjoyed this episode be sure to check out :

Jonathan Saar: Hello everyone and welcome to the JuvoHub Podcast: A Helping Hand In Property Management. Grateful to have another episode today and share with you some insights from Pauline Houchins, executive vice president of First Communities. I know I just butchered your last name. Totally, it sounds like it.

Pauline Houchins: That is okay. Absolutely no problem.

Jonathan Saar: Say it for us.

Pauline Houchins: It's easy to do. [inaudible 00:00:39] worse. Houchins.

Jonathan Saar: Houchins, why did I ... See, we were just talking about that before the show started, not seeing each other for a year and I can't even pronounce someone I've known for quite a few years name correctly. Great way to start the show.

Pauline Houchins: Hey, no worries. It'll be a lasting impression I'm sure.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, yeah. Well, Mark can share ... We'll have some blooper highlights and some episode at some point that we'll put together because that's just the name of the game on here but welcome, Pauline. It's so great to have you. Grateful to have you on the show today.

Pauline Houchins: Oh, it's my pleasure. Thank you guys.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah. Great topic. We'll get into that subject in just a second but let's also introduce Mark Howell from Howell Creative Concepts. What's up, man? How are things?

Mark Howell: Hey buddy, how are you? Yeah. Thanks for having me again. You're keeping me around, that's a good sign, right?.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah.

Mark Howell: And Pauline, what... Houchins. I love Pauline Houchins. Yeah, we've got a great topic today and many people may ... Sorry, many people may know that Pauline and I go way back. This conversation is going to be a great one today. I'm excited about this.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah. And please don't feel bad Pauline, I can barely pronounce my own last name because people mess it up all the time. You think it would be the simplest name, one syllable, [inaudible 00:02:09] letters.

Pauline Houchins: Listen, I said, my maiden name was 14 letters long. Lets not even worry about that. I grew up having to pronounce my name, first and last name, if that makes you feel any better.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah.

Pauline Houchins: Actually for me, call me whatever you want. Just call me.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah.

Mark Howell: Exactly.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah. Well, today's topic is ironically enough, professional adaptability. Lots of things that we've had to adapt to, especially in this last year or so but we appreciate having you on the show. You've been in the industry for many, many years. Now, executive vice president of First Communities and you've been in that role for some time now. You just bring a wealth of information to our industry, whether we've been in the industry for a long time and especially thinking of all the new ones that are coming into the industry, just coming out of college who listen to this show. We look forward to your insight. Mark, what do we have on the docket today? Take it from here my man. What are we talking about?

Mark Howell: Yeah, I tell you ... It's a fascinating conversation. Honestly, professional adaptability, especially this past year 2020. Whew, that was a tough one. And didn't we all have to stop and pivot and adapt to something, some kind of change. If you got through 2020 without making major changes in your life or in your professional life, then I don't know how but Pauline, I'm dying to get the conversation started. I've got several questions to keep us going but I don't think I'll need them all because I know you and I have talked about this through the last year of 2020 but I would love for you to tell me and the audience, how did you guys engage with your employees? If we think about professional adaptability in the workplace, as a leader in the industry, as a leader of so many people in your organization, how difficult was that? How did you do it? What were some of the biggest obstacles that you had last year because look, what we know is that 2020 just slapped us across the face. What was it, March? We didn't even know what was going to happen, right.

Pauline Houchins: Yes.

Mark Howell: This adaptability thing just smacked you in the face and I'd love to know, how did you adapt to it? Tell me.

Pauline Houchins: Well, first of all, thank you guys for the gracious introduction. I certainly appreciate it. I'm very honored to have been selected to speak today but I think what we learned about 2020, was that you cannot get comfortable with the way you used to do things, right. And I think in our industry, we are used to doing things the same way for the last 20, 30, 40 years. Not a whole lot has changed. We've had some technology and social media entering the picture but as far as how we were running our business was very much the same. It was static. It was people show up, we show them an apartment, how they get to us may have changed and evolved but not that much in between had changed. What happened in March for us and a lot of companies, regardless of your size, is that a lot of quick decisions had to be made. Not only did they have to be made but they had to be executed. And then everybody had to follow that execution very fast.

Pauline Houchins: And there wasn't any room for error while you were doing it because it caused health issues, fair housing issues. Of course, a lot of eviction moratoriums were a huge component on how we executed a lot of those things. What the executive team had done at First Communities and I'm sure a lot of other companies probably did the same thing, is that we worked for about 72 hours straight. And that meant where we all came together and said, "How are we going to take this information and have about 60,000 unit portfolio get this information?"

Pauline Houchins: And of course, the first place we turned to was Zoom or GoToMeeting which before, when people used to invite you to Zoom, you'd be like, "I don't know how to work that thing."

Pauline Houchins: It was just not as relevant but that was the first place you had to start. The second was really having a game plan together on how you were going to take properties from being open all the time, to actually shutting down your communities and how you were going to conduct that business with a shutdown. We had to use Zoom to communicate to our team but we also have what's called Jostle at First Communities, which is like a workplace Facebook platform. You're able to put a lot of your policies on there, a library, access links, put videos and upload those videos. People can refer back to that data outside of a Zoom meeting or a company update that we would have. We had them daily but we also had company updates through our CEO on a weekly basis, as things were evolving. Each executive has regionals.

Pauline Houchins: In each regional were getting daily testimonials to their team and they also use Zoom to communicate a lot with their team but they used a lot of different things to keep people engaged, which I know we're going to talk a lot about that later on in the program but that's pretty much what we had to do right off the bat. And I think the biggest obstacle was the technology piece where if you were expecting people to be on a Zoom, we had to have webcams, our IT department had to move fairly quickly. We're talking about a 48 hour period in order to provide a lot of these services to all of our properties, so we were able to conduct a lot of these meetings online and our telephone providers and our services but we knew exactly what we had hit first. And I think that that's what made the process a lot more seamless, is that we knew that over-communication was not something that we were afraid of doing. And I think that really helped the success at First Communities with our employees feel really connected to our corporate team during a very unusual time.

Mark Howell: You bring up a great point about just getting this information out to the teams in such a short amount of time. I think you said 72 hours or 42 hours or something. And it makes me think, what a trying time for ... Let's talk about the generations.

Pauline Houchins: Yeah.

Mark Howell: When you think about the ... There are five different generations working in our industry at one time right now, right. And so where these younger generations were probably easier to adapt to the technology, what we all had to pivot toward to stay in contact, to offer education but also, the technology involved in just keeping our business open, the virtual touring and things like that. How was that .. Were there problems trying to engage with different generations accepting the technology change that happened?

Pauline Houchins: Mark, what I learned a lot about 2020, is that people will learn to adapt if that is the only option that is available. And we tend to downplay a lot of what we think, even at my age where I'm like, "Oh, I'm too old for that. I don't know what I'm doing. I don't know how to use that."

Pauline Houchins: Well in March, I didn't know how to learn or use a lot of the technology piece that the marketing team who's super savvy, was always pushing down our throats, right. And now, I find myself ... Well, I had to learn a lot of those things. It wasn't an option for me. Now, the difference in just adapting to it is how we were able to use the information that was changing and knew that was going to be impactful for everybody. If you weren't comfortable talking in a Zoom, we provided videos and tutorials for things, so that way you can reference them back in Jostle or whatever platform other companies have. That just happened to be the one that we used. And so they can reference that. We had discussion groups open depending on which topic, whether it's evictions, whether it's virtual tours. And so you could go into these discussion groups and ask your question in a very comfortable setting.

Pauline Houchins: And I think that what we learned is whether you were 20 or 60 or 70 or whatever age group you were in, we were able to find touch points that everybody felt comfortable using but at the end of the day, we had ... Virtual leasing for example, was something that we never thought we would do, right. We always said, "Oh, my gosh, you would never just show a unit and not take them to a unit or an apartment home."

Pauline Houchins: Well because of COVID, we had to adapt, which meant that a lot of properties were closed. And so if we wanted to continue leasing, we had to do different things like using different programs, like [Brentley 00:10:38] and self guided tours but we set up virtual videos where we used some of our staff members and got them excited about doing their own virtual video, sending it to us, doing different ... Of course, media clips so that we made sure that it flowed well but everyone participated and they felt like they were evolving into the process. I think that when we put caps on what we think people are going to learn, is when they start showing that they can't. And that's why we set it up as a, "You may not learn in this particular fashion but let's try these four different things and see if that sticks."

Pauline Houchins: And that's what we found. And at the end, people who want to be in this business really love what they do. They find ways to stay with the group, even if they're not learning like the group.

Mark Howell: Yeah. Trust me, that's why I keep young people around me all the time. Young people [crosstalk 00:11:33] say 28 and younger or that age group, they are my new best friends because I don't know how to do half of the stuff that's coming out with technology today but you're right, in 2020, I definitely had to adapt as well. And I remember getting really frustrated with Zoom. Right as was all happening and everyone transitioned to needing a Zoom account or platform ... I don't know if you guys remember this but all of Zoom shut down one day. And it was across the country and it got so inundated with so many people trying to use it. And I was right in the middle of trying to log on to a really important call. And I got so frustrated with technology. I started throwing things and I said, "Okay, let me just call some young people and find out what's going on."

Mark Howell: ... but I realized it was more of a global problem but yeah. You're right. People will learn, you have to. You have to learn to adapt because if you don't, this world will leave you behind. When I think about what we had to go through last year in 2020 and our topic, this professional adaptability, how difficult was it from your point of view, as a leader of so many people, keeping them engaged when residents were upset and keeping ... To me, it seemed like we had this complete emotional, intelligent breakdown. Not so much on our side, meaning our employees but residents literally broke down. And so how do you keep your employees and team members engaged in their job and what they're required to do every day and still come to work and not throw keys down on the desk. Tell me a little bit about that.

Pauline Houchins: It's funny, we talk about how we operated based in 2019 versus 2020. And we felt we were closer as a portfolio and as a company of 1200 employees because we had to come together in a way that was a lot more intimate than what we typically do, right, which is you get your reports and we're talking about asset management and we're strictly just more of a business perspective. I know a lot of people are like, "Well, I feel very close to my employees. And as a company, we're super engaging and we bring motivational speakers."

Pauline Houchins: And all those are great but it doesn't necessarily get to the heart of what everybody cares about. And so in 2020, what we saw is that we went from property specific issues to really global concerns that everybody had. The concerns of the residents were the same as our employees. We did send a lot of correspondence to our residents, communicating to them on a weekly basis, changes that were in the news. How does that impact our property? If they came across financial hardships, what they can do as options. And so that communication that was fed to the property level really helped our teams manage through a lot of those difficult conversations with the residents. We didn't just put the onus out on the community director and say, "Well, good luck. I know it's tough. People are struggling, they've lost jobs but you're a seasoned professional. You should be able to handle this on your own, on top of all the other thousand changing protocols that we threw on you today."

Pauline Houchins: And so corporate took that responsibility to make sure that that communication was still filtered through to our sites because ultimately, the residents are the most important key players here in the equation outside of our employees but as far as the worries that we had to deal with ... Look, the pandemic universally shifted our focus to larger drivers. And I think that we had adapt to our employees as well. We had eviction moratoriums, evolving policies and protocols but naturally, the one thing that we typically didn't have to deal much with was the personal concerns, homeschooling, taking care of elderly parents. They also felt like they were in isolation.

Pauline Houchins: A lot of people that are in this industry are people obviously, people people and so that piece of ... Having to separate from that, really caused a lot of isolation and depression. And so what we found really helped and what made the team thrive, is that we would do these daily motivational devotionals where we focused on something positive, either that was happening at the property, something exciting in an employee's life, funny memes. And all of that sounds so trivial and trite because a lot of people are like, "Well, we did that too."

Pauline Houchins: And it's like, "But ours was and still is constant, 365 days."

Pauline Houchins: That meant from the beginning of March up until today, we still have these things at play and really help people feel connected in a lot of ways.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, that's ...

Mark Howell: Go ahead, Jonathan.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah. I wish we had a ... Maybe we need to filter that in somewhere, just a huge round of applause for that, Pauline. And that is just amazing, that beyond the policies and procedures, the bottom line, the PNL, the ROI and all those other standard property management terms, that you and First Communities would be all so super focused on the mental health of the team. And also [inaudible 00:16:58].

Pauline Houchins: The mental health was a huge component of that. I would find myself ... Typically in 2019, when I would be talking to an employee would say, "Great job on meeting NOI."

Pauline Houchins: Or, "Hey, what are we going to do about this expense?"

Pauline Houchins: And I found myself definitely shifting as a leader in 2020, where I would say, "All right, what can we do differently as a team to hit this small goal?"

Pauline Houchins: Versus hitting them up with these large expectations but ultimately ending every conversation with, "How are you today? Just checking in. What can I do for you? Is there something that you want to talk about? Do you want to vent?"

Pauline Houchins: And that allowed them to be really transparent and honest about a lot of things that maybe in 2019, they were not as comfortable sharing about ... Maybe it's the way First Communities had a specific policy that didn't work or maybe they did have some personal concerns, health-related. Feeling of overwhelmed and depression, a lot of emotional things that they weren't [inaudible 00:17:58] to articulate even with family members. And you have to find that safe person in your workspace that can help you work through that because the mental piece, I think even today, we're going to have a lot of those filtering into 2021. A vaccine does not cure your emotional trauma of what occurred for you in 2020. And I think that as leaders, you have to accept that responsibility.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, what a [inaudible 00:18:25].

Mark Howell: It's funny, you ... Oh, sorry. Go ahead Jonathan.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, no. Just that's it. Just what a takeaway.

Mark Howell: Yeah.

Jonathan Saar: I can't emphasize that enough of just that is solid. Yeah. Go ahead, Mark.

Mark Howell: I love that you brought that up because last night I was reading something about just change in our environment professionally and also emotionally but it was talking about the new leader of 2021. New leaders in the future are going to have to also be a little bit more adaptable, pivot a little bit when it comes to what your employees need from you. And I want to go back to this generation thing in a second but the point of what I was reading ... It was interesting, it said that the 2021 leader is going to have to look at the emotional intelligence of their employees more so today than they ever did in the past, right.

Mark Howell: What we might've been hiring for in the past has become very, very different for our 2021. First of all, what I call the kids, the younger generations that are coming up, they're going to expect more. They're going to want more. Their interviewing process is going to be totally different. As a leader today, you should be hiring someone that has incredible emotional intelligence, truly based on just what we witnessed this last year of 2020. All of the change, all of the turmoil that our country and people went through but would you say ... Or do you find that there was a difference in the worries from generations? When you talked about ... And I think about this, a 20 something year old's worry about COVID might be different from say mine or a 60 year old or an employee that ... Like you said, they're worried about taking care of their mother, their father, a family member but did you notice in your organization that the concerns were different from generation to generation?

Pauline Houchins: ... necessarily think that they were different because the action may be different but the result of that feeling is the same. If you're concerned about your social environment and how that was really important to you, it still led to depression when it was taken away. If you were worried about your elderly parents getting COVID and you had do certain things and not see them, the result was still depression, isolation. Of course for us, what we focused on more was that, "Okay, we know that we're going to have to be adaptable to the needs of our employees. Let's stay ahead of communication and finding out what those drivers are."

Pauline Houchins: If we know that somebody is struggling socially, we have them in charge of creating our resident social calendar, our virtual social calendar and that helped that group of people feel, "Okay. Well, I may not be able to see my friends but I'm still being creative here. Maybe that'll obviously leak into my personal life and I can have virtual happy hours at home."

Pauline Houchins: If we had people that were dealing with children and homeschooling, we created skeleton shifts, so that if you were a parent and you had to do homeschooling, we allowed for specific hours of that employee to be able to do that and still contribute and still get paid and still feel like they didn't have to worry about employment. I think it's a matter of not one thing will fit the entire group but if the overall goal is to provide flexibility, then the worries all seem to take care of itself when you really focus on what's really important for specific people.

Mark Howell: Yeah, so true. And you bring up a great point. You have to have this ... Again, the professional adaptability, the insight to say, "Each of my employees are going to have very different needs."

Mark Howell: And so staying focused on that, staying focused on "How do I keep them engaged?"

Mark Howell: And finding out what each of them wants very specifically. Good, good for you.

Pauline Houchins: Well, I think as leaders, we tend to just say, "All right. Well, I'm going to force motivation on you. We're going to force camaraderie together."

Pauline Houchins: And you can't. If you know that you're concerned about something outside of your professional workspace at that moment, it falls flat, right. Who wants to be motivated if you're worried about your children passing their history test while you have to get on this Zoom call with your boss, who wants to force some motivational devotional for that day? And so I think that having employee engagement surveys were really big for us on asking the questions of, "What do you find helpful? What time of day is Zoom meetings helpful for you? How quickly you want this meeting to last, do you want to be a 10 minute shot"

Pauline Houchins: And I think that helps. You have to ask people the question in a survey format so that you can definitely create platforms that are going to be impactful. Just saying you have a Zoom meeting with some motivational one, two, threes and tutorials, doesn't necessarily mean that it's going to be impactful.

Mark Howell: Yeah. That's so true. I have one question left. I asked this of a lot of my friends and people in the industry but would you be willing to tell me something that you learned about yourself maybe professionally, even personally. In 2020, did you learn something that you, Pauline Houchins, had to become more adaptable about?

Pauline Houchins: Sure. I learned a lot in 2020 about myself, just professionally and personally. It doesn't matter how long you've been in this business. I think I've been in this business 24 years at this point. I stopped counting after a while but leadership or management before, has always been A plus B equals C. And, "I'm here to motivate you and guide you and that's important."

Pauline Houchins: ... but performance drives a lot of how people view their overall job function. And that's just embedded in us as people but I also worked a lot of hours and traveled a lot and was the typical corporate employee. And I felt that you needed to do that in order to be successful. What 2020 taught me, is that you can put in a lot of hours and still have a balance at home, which I think is super important, especially as my child is growing up and is now going to be a teenager in the next month, that there are things that still require me to be successful at home, is my presence. And homeschooling my son really taught me, "Well, I'm never going to have this chance ever again. This is an opportunity that was gifted to me in a very bad time in our of course, global environment."

Pauline Houchins: ... but I learned that time is fleeting and that I'll never get this back. And so going into 2021, I'm very fortunate to work with an amazing executive team that allows us that flexibility. And I found that although I am still working a lot of hours, it's because by choice. I enjoy working but I don't necessarily feel that pressure to sit in the car for an hour to commute. And I think that that'll probably be the case for me from now on. I think that that's just a decision that I made that I feel has made me a better mom, better wife, sometimes. Ultimately, a better leader because my employees are getting me at a whole person instead of these increments of [inaudible 00:25:56].

Mark Howell: Yeah. I love that. I will tell you one thing ... And I'll talk more personal. What I learned about myself personally, is I didn't know that I had the ability to binge watch an entire Netflix series in one day.

Pauline Houchins: Well, yeah. Or in my case, gain 20 pounds [inaudible 00:26:13] but oh well.

Mark Howell: Yeah. I definitely have to teach myself to ... Or continue to be a self motivator because that 2020 ... Boy, I tell you what, I could find myself cuddled up on the couch and a blanket and binge watching some TV that I never knew that it was possible to do. Jonathan, did you find out anything crazy about yourself that you knew you had to either accept, adapt to or get away from in 2020?

Jonathan Saar: Yeah. Man, I didn't have a chance to think about that one, Mark. I'll have to ... But it resonated with me what both of you said. The fact that we came out of it with life lessons is just perfect. If we went through this and didn't feel like we didn't appreciate something more ... Yeah. We've lost people to COVID and it's taught me that life is so awesome. Not that I didn't ... I don't think I didn't know that before but just on that level, just seeing the impact that it's had on so many people, it's helped me become more empathetic. Just having people in the family too and friends who deal with mental health challenges. And then just seeing how this affected ... I can't imagine anybody saying, "Oh, yeah. 2020 was awesome. I didn't have an issue. I just cared about life like no big deal."

Jonathan Saar: No. It affected everybody and it's affecting us still now. And so I think just being more aware of what that looks like, I guess Mark, is my ... What I tried to improve on. I like what [inaudible 00:28:03] said too, Pauline. Time is so precious and you just ... You soak up every moment, for sure. Yeah, good question.

Mark Howell: We'll turn that over to our philosophical channel now and spiritual health. Tune into [inaudible 00:28:20].

Pauline Houchins: Yeah, the spa channel.

Mark Howell: Yeah.

Pauline Houchins: Yeah.

Mark Howell: It's funny. Yeah. I didn't want us to go down that deep path there but I try to ask a lot of people that I come in contact with because I'm all about change. I'm going to teach a series of change. What happened to us in 2020? What are we taking from 2020 into 2021 but yeah, for me ... And it wasn't just COVID, right. It was all about as people, what we watched happen in our country and our society to each other, about all types of different things. People are hurting and it definitely opens my heart. It opened my heart to say, "Maybe your mouth should do a little less of the talking and let your heart do more of the listening or talking."

Mark Howell: This mouth is uncontrollable but I definitely want to open my heart more because this country ... People, not even this country but human, we need human kindness right now. And so I have loved our topic. Thank you so much, Pauline. And I think Jonathan ...

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, [inaudible 00:29:23].

Mark Howell: You had one last question for Pauline.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, it was great. I took a lot of mental notes but I also wrote something down that you said earlier, "People will adapt if that is the only option that is available."

Jonathan Saar: That was a quote ... I had to write that down.

Pauline Houchins: Thank you.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, beautiful.

Pauline Houchins: It's quotable.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah, it is. It's totally quotable. And it's not negative, it's just, "Okay, this is where we are at."

Jonathan Saar: I wrote that down.

Pauline Houchins: Thanks, Jonathan.

Jonathan Saar: Any other quotable quotes or tips that you would share as [inaudible 00:29:57].

Pauline Houchins: I don't know. Well, one, thank you for that. We literally just had a call last week and one of the things we talked about is be mindful of our business. And the reason why I shared that and really wanted our teams to resonate with that statement, is that if you really look at what we do, it's so important. We're basically providing the most safe haven of all aspects of someone's life, which is their home. What could be more important than that? Especially in 2020, we all lived within our four walls. Some want to change after that but ultimately, we provided that. And I think sometimes we forget what impact we have as a society in this business. Obviously, we're a multi-billion dollar industry that takes care of people's investments. Not only are we providing homes but we're also giving investment opportunities for other people. And I think that we downplay our industry a lot and we make a lot of jokes about what we do.

Pauline Houchins: I remember a long time ago, I knew somebody that said, "Well, what do you do all day? You ride golf carts and bake cookies all day."

Pauline Houchins: That is [inaudible 00:31:07] really think about our business. When in fact, if you really look at it, one of the top five businesses to be in is real estate and development. And so if we make our employees feel like that's all they do all day, then that's how they treat their business. And so when I say be mindful of our business, I like to show our employees why they're so important by showing them how they impact the major fundamentals of someone's life. And that is either in an investment or by providing them a home, which there's nothing more important than that, other than your health.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah.

Pauline Houchins: I think that that's probably the one thing that I want everybody to just really remember about what we do [inaudible 00:31:49].

Jonathan Saar: Yeah. Beautiful. Be mindful of your business.

Pauline Houchins: That's right.

Jonathan Saar: And it sounds so nice the way you said it and how typically, most people would say that. Just a little bit of background. Context, it's [crosstalk 00:32:02].

Pauline Houchins: It depends what day, Jonathan in my [crosstalk 00:32:06].

Jonathan Saar: Yeah but a nice spin. And what an epic show this is, eh Mark. Just what a great guest. And wow, just your experience and having all this insight and just clarity. That's what I ... Just listening to you, it's like clarity. We had to do this. We did that. We adapted. We moved on, changed how we did this. Worked with our team, residents and so on. Just fantastic. One other item I had a quick question on just because I know our audience may have not caught it. You mentioned a platform that you were using, was it Jostle that you're using?

Pauline Houchins: Yeah. It's Jostle, J-O-S-T-L-E.

Jonathan Saar: Okay.

Pauline Houchins: It's considered a workplace ... Like I said, Facebook platform but really, it's so much more than that. If you guys have an opportunity to look into it, it's great.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah.

Pauline Houchins: I do feel like it has kept our entire company solely united in a platform outside of Facebook, okay because Facebook tends to have a lot of the personal component. And then it gets down these rabbit holes where people start hating each other because they have different political views or whatever goes on on their Facebook page. This is just a ... It's strictly work-related and it's been wonderful.

Jonathan Saar: Okay, cool. Yeah. I thought that's what you heard ... What you said and I heard. I just want to make sure I put that down in the show notes in case anybody was wanting to know what they ... If they're looking into something like that because that's ... Virtual technology is really important this day and age.

Pauline Houchins: Huge.

Jonathan Saar: Thank you again, Pauline. Amazing to have you on the show.

Pauline Houchins: Oh, my gosh. It's my pleasure.

Jonathan Saar: Yeah. Can people connect with you in any way on social or via your company?

Pauline Houchins: Yeah. I'm actually on Facebook, Pauline Houchins. You can of course message me there. Of course, my email, which you guys can share, phouchins@firstcommunities.com. I do get a lot of emails here and there after teaching a class and I love hearing from different people. I'm always available to answer anything.

Jonathan Saar: Beautiful, beautiful. Thank you for that. And Mark, as always. Great, great commentary my friend and great questions and what a great discussion. How can people connect with you, Mark? Just remind us.

Mark Howell: You can reach me at Howl, which is HO-W-L, creativeconcepts.com. That's my website and just ... Or my email address. It's a long one. It's mark @howl, which is H-O-W-L creativeconcepts.com but yes, great conversation. Love it. Pauline, we're definitely going to have to have you back on our show.

Pauline Houchins: I would love that. Thank you guys so much. I appreciate you all.

Jonathan Saar: For sure, for sure, for sure. Yeah. Make sure you look up Mark for all of his awesome training that he's doing for the industry too, howlcreativeconcepts.com. Again, thank you. This has been episode 19. My name is Jonathan Saar from Market me Social. We appreciate all of you who are listening. Please take a moment, give us a review and share this podcast with your network as well. Thank you everyone. We'll see you next time, take care.

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